2017 Savana Not cold at idle

[zigblazer]

Started taking it apart today because the parts showed up early. Condenser was full of bugs again, but 95% of them fell off with a light brushing this time. Anyway, I can't find the orifice tube. I thought it should be in the evap inlet, alldata shows the evap inlet for a location, but there is nothing there. At All. Now I've never worked on a full size van A/C before. Many pickups, a few mini vans, several cars, and about a hundred semi-trucks. I've seen a few odd ball vehicles that have it in a little goofy place, and I don't see any special spot for it on this van. It is a split system for front and rear, other than that, it is a simple system.

I believe someone removed it and for one reason or another never reinstalled the orifice tube. That would completely explain the lack of a/c at idle. Unless it is ultra deep into the evap, it isn't there.

[Carguychris85]

Orifice tube should be in the evaporator inlet. I have had probably a dozen of the Express/Savanna systems apart and same difficult as heck place to get at location for all of them. I say difficult because they love to stick and it is hard to get a puller on the tube where the line sits in regard to the fender. I would be surprised it cools at all with a missing tube. Is the evaporator hard line dimpled? Perhaps the factory missed that step and it wedged deep into the tube.

[zigblazer]

Finished putting everything together, even got the fans mounted, but no wiring done yet. I have less than two pounds of r-134a left and the system takes 3.1, so not enough for a second try. Luckily it works great. It was only 70 degrees in the shop, but after I charged it, I had cold air constantly from the front and rear vents at an idle. I see why there isn't a lot of flow out of the front most vents in the back. It doesn't look like there is any ducting in the ceiling, just a gap created by the roofing panel.

I have no idea how it cooled at all without the orifice tube, but I am very confident that there is no trace of an old one in the system. One confirming piece is my high pressure went up where it should be. I had the right port after all (although that is one part that had me looking for a different location of the tube).
Instead of the low and high almost being equal, low dropped down to 20-30psi, while high went up around 150.

Front evap was clean, not hardly any dust buildup. Rear was a little dirty, but could have been much worse. And probably will be after a few years with the dogs. Fans mounted up nicely, and just need to have the wiring finished.

Thank you for the help. My wife should be happy when she uses it tomorrow.

[zigblazer]

Here are the fans mounted. And the rear evap before I cleaned it.

[tbirdtbird]

Good job.
It doesn’t take much crud on an evap to reduce performance. Keep an eye on it, there will be mega dog hair on it soon enough.
Please be sure you have the full charge of 134 in there else you will not get adequate oil return, and compressors like to do nasty things in that setting.

[zigblazer]

I put exactly 3.1lbs in. As specified. On a side note, no oil would drain from the old compressor, as in not a single drop even turning the pulley. However, I drained about 8 oz out of the old receiver/dryer. Total system spec including compressor is 11oz.

There was dye in the system. I suspect they had work done to it at some point. Other than the missing orifice tube, I do not see anything that was obviously replaced. The evap up front has the locating dimples for the orifice tube.

I pulled a vacuum for about half an hour and closed the valves while I put everything else back together. It held 26inhg of vacuum for over an hour and I ran the vacuum pump for another half hour just to be sure all of the residual moisture and chemicals from the flush were completely removed.

[Carguychris85]

Sounds like you made good headway. Fan install also looks good. Almost like they should have been there from the factory. I have both of my fans on the bottom rows of the condenser vs your offset mounting. Probably tomato vs tomatoe but I made the assumption the condenser was hottest at the top and to me made more sense to further cool the refrigerant after it liquified by pushing more cfm through the already cooled off area of the condenser. My fan mounting was also dictated by the transmisison cooler and are mounted to the edge of the condenser only because it has an 11" wide, 10.5" tall transmission cooler mounted dead center biased toward the top. Low mount gave me more space for the fans width under the cooler. I used insert rivet nuts myself on the upper mounting bolts but elected to use self tappers on the bottom into the plastic of the core support. Would have had to pull the bumper or core support otherwise. I run my fans off a relay tied into the orange trigger wire for the front blower relay. I find that on cooler days or on the highway when less than full front blower speed is needed to keep the interior cool there is little reason for the fans to run. On a hot day, idling around town the front blower is on high speed and the fans turn on. Saves wear and tear on the alternator and fans when they are not needed due to lower cooling demands.

One thing I do need to add to my 97 van is those nice air guides GM started adding to the later vans to guide airflow through the cooling stack rather than allowing air to pass through the headlight openings. Mine recirculates a fair bit of hot air from the engine compartment back through the cooling stack through the headlight openings without those fins as well. I actually forgot to ask if your van had those air guides but picture makes it clear that it does. I wish those factory air guides had been longer and reached all the way below the bumper. Shut the hood and you will find a fair bit of hot air still makes its way back in front of the condenser. I have considered buying 2 pair from the wrecking yards, epoxying them together for more length and triming just enough to clear the bumper. My 97 now has a plastic guide at the bottom of the core support as well to help prevent hot air from entering from the bottom. When I first got my hands on my 97 it was missing may have been built without it for all I know, noticed the piece in a later 01/02 van and snagged it from the treasure yard. Made an immediate difference. I also gave a GMC grille for my Chevy to swap at some point as well. The GMC design is much more open than the Chevy design. Painting the GMC grille and installing it is on my list of things to do someday.

[zigblazer]

I think it is time for a new gauge set. The gauges still work great, but the hoses are giving me more problems. About 10 years old, and a cheap set to begin with, probably just time to start over. I use it 2-3 times per year. Only filling a system average of once a year. My vehicles are slowly getting newer, sort of. My trucks are still 12-19 years old, my wife's vehicles range from 4-11 years old. I no longer have old junk at least. Now everything is in very good shape (except maybe her ram, but that is another story). So I'm not needing to do as much a/c work.

Long story short, do you have any suggestions for a cheaper gauge set that is good enough quality to work with little use for another 10 years? Or should I get another set from amazon or someplace like it.

[JohnHere]

On a side note, no oil would drain from the old compressor, as in not a single drop even turning the pulley. However, I drained about 8 oz out of the old receiver/dryer. Total system spec including compressor is 11oz.

Eight ounces of oil came out of the old R/D and none from the compressor? Oh, my

There was dye in the system. I suspect they had work done to it at some point. Other than the missing orifice tube, I do not see anything that was obviously replaced. The evap up front has the locating dimples for the orifice tube.

The OT was missing yet the system still worked to some degree. Amazing! Well, at least the OT couldn't plug up

[Carguychris85]

On a side note, no oil would drain from the old compressor, as in not a single drop even turning the pulley. However, I drained about 8 oz out of the old receiver/dryer. Total system spec including compressor is 11oz.

Eight ounces of oil came out of the old R/D and none from the compressor? Oh, my

There was dye in the system. I suspect they had work done to it at some point. Other than the missing orifice tube, I do not see anything that was obviously replaced. The evap up front has the locating dimples for the orifice tube.

The OT was missing yet the system still worked to some degree. Amazing! Well, at least the OT couldn't plug up

My first compressor on my 97 had no oil either when it locked up. About 8 oz in the rear suction line. I replaced that compressor in mid 2000s. Ran the second until I put a 383 in that van in 2021 and rebuilt the aystem again because I needed to open the system anyway. Oil was all throughout the system and compressor had plenty in it. Only difference was the replacement compressor had called for Pag 46 and I added 4 oz of Ice32 at the first rebuild. Very little oil in the rear suction line when I flushed it the 2nd time.