Can I test a R12 system with R134a for a few minutes?

[Tim]

Please remove the eBay links from our site. They do not support the costs of running it.

If running R12 then there is no need for an upgrade condenser or an office tube change, IMO. Ford spent a lot of money to determine the proper oil return and pressure levels when designing these systems.

DetroitAC and or Ice probably can expand on this.

[JohnHere]

I am not going to do the conversion to R134a and so it is my understanding that the original Tube/Fin condenser should work ok with the R12.

The tube-and-fin condenser also will work with R-134a although you might (or might not) notice slightly less cooling performance over R-12, which is getting much harder to find and more outlandishly priced every week--something to keep in mind.

[Tim]

The tube-and-fin condenser also will work with R-134a although you might (or might not) notice slightly less cooling performance over R-12, which is getting much harder to find and more outlandishly priced every week--something to keep in mind.

Correct John.

T&F will work with R134a if there is enough capacity to remove the heat load. The issue, is there enough "area" of the condenser to do so? speaking in general terms, not on this specific vehicle.

[JohnHere]

Interestingly, I own a 1994 Toyota Camry Wagon V6 that I bought new and that I still drive regularly. It was a rather rare vehicle back in '94, and it's even rarer today. Everything is original. It still turns heads everywhere I drive it, and "What is it?" usually is the first question I get.

My wagon, which is in pristine condition with "only" 240,000 miles on the clock, was the first Toyota model that switched to the new-at-the-time R-134a refrigerant.

After owning it for a while, I noticed that it had an unusual tube-and-fin condenser and a R/D with a sight glass. My guess is that Toyota was using-up A/C parts that they had on hand from the older R-12 vehicles, until they ran out and switched over to the correct parts. Still to this day, it'll freeze me out on a 95-degree day in the humid South, regularly producing sub-40-degree center-vent temps.

My wagon also was the first Toyota Camry that had OBD-II diagnostics. Most of the other Camrys of that vintage--including wagons, sedans, and coupes--still had OBD-I.

[Tim]

John, the first year Tacoma, 95.5 had the most amazing A/C I have ever seen. And yes, it was R134a!

[JohnHere]

Incredible

They must have hit the engineering sweet spot with those early R-134a systems despite the T&F condenser in my wagon. Toyota A/C systems also use a TXV, which IMHO is superior to an OT.

[Charrie]

Thank you or removing the links Tim. I just got home within the hour and so didn't have any other time to do it till now. I will make sure not to post any more.

I agree with you about the original ford T&F condenser Tim. Almost all of the guys in the older Ford van forums who have converted to R134 have complained they are not excited about the results. That is part of the reason we went back with R12 6 years ago when we rebuilt the system.

[tbirdtbird]

I'm reading the last few posts with interest.
I think forum posters are underestimating what Tim can do with his pricing. As I have said before at least let him price out what you want.
The last 508-type compressor I purchased I expected Chinese, since everything comes from there now. What I got was a Japanese 508-equivalent that I am very happy with, and the price was super. I did not know such a compressor was even available. He is not just the site owner, he ran an AC shop in the past and really knows his brands and sources. Just sayin'. Just because a compressor says GM or FoMoCo hardly means it is USA made. I don't think any are at all now.